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View Full Version : World News whatever happened to the Saddam trial?



shaggie
23-07--2006, 08:06 PM
People were so enthused about this one when it started. It's turned into the OJ trial.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/07/23/iraq.main/index.html

Not much coverage of it in the U.S. media. Too busy covering the 100 deaths a day in the civil war in Iraq, not to mention problems returning to Beirut.

.

phil
24-07--2006, 02:22 PM
I think he got an ASBO and 50 hours community service.

velvet
24-07--2006, 02:58 PM
I think he got an ASBO and 50 hours community service.

Didn't know he was trialed by the Dutch? ;)

matthew
25-07--2006, 04:05 PM
People were so enthused about this one when it started. It's turned into the OJ trial.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/07/23/iraq.main/index.html

Not much coverage of it in the U.S. media. Too busy covering the 100 deaths a day in the civil war in Iraq, not to mention problems returning to Beirut.

.

Hello Shaggie.. :waves:

I have too admit my enthusiasm has wained a little .... what with other pressing situations occuring. Like you mention. If they were just focusing on the trial.. i guess the charge would be ''Why are you ignoring the seemingly never ending deaths..or the situation in Beirut'' .

I suspect closer too the end of the trial it will be picked up again.

I wonder why nothing positive is ever mentioned about Iraq ?.

aarghapanda
25-07--2006, 04:08 PM
He paid his TV License and everything was forgotten.

Atomik
26-07--2006, 11:25 AM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/5215866.stm

Lunar Seed
26-07--2006, 11:29 AM
I wonder why nothing positive is ever mentioned about Iraq ?.

Because there is actually nothing positive about it, imo.
(unless, of course, you are a Haliburton shareholder.)

velvet
26-07--2006, 12:07 PM
Because there is actually nothing positive about it, imo.
(unless, of course, you are a Haliburton shareholder.)

What's the nature like over there? Any good? Maybe we could convince the middle east to stop fighting and become a nice vacation resort with spa's and camel rides :D

matthew
26-07--2006, 03:53 PM
Because there is actually nothing positive about it, imo.
(unless, of course, you are a Haliburton shareholder.)

I was hopeing for something less cynical. I crossed my fingers and everything.



What's the nature like over there? Any good? Maybe we could convince the middle east to stop fighting and become a nice vacation resort with spa's and camel rides :D

Thanks to USAID and other contributors such as Canada and Japan the marshlands are regaining there beauty once again.. that would be a good place to start i would imagine.
http://www.cimiwetlands.net/gallery/albums/vistas/P1300129_Boat_at_Sunset.jpg
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=iraq%20marshlands&sa=N&tab=iw
I suspect though some critics would denounce the 'desrtuction of another part of the world by the capitalist blah blah blah etc etc etc'

shaggie
08-08--2006, 02:16 PM
Iraq has had 6000 deaths in May and June alone and over 12,000 since the year began.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5567187

The Bush administration is going to be sending about 3700 troops to Baghdad in an effort to quell the violence and to try to avert some embarassment for the November Congressional elections.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14092621/

shaggie
08-08--2006, 02:18 PM
Doesn't look all that good regarding the situation with Iran, Syria, Lebanon, and Israel. Things are unraveling in the Mideast.

shaggie
08-08--2006, 02:19 PM
What happened to all those people, including Bush, that were so happy with a quick pullout of Syrian peacekeeping forces from Lebanon a year or so ago and waving the old golden democracy flag around? Look what happens when there is no force there to keep order. Now there is a nice mess between Israel and Lebanon. The situation hasn't looked this bad in Beirut since the early 80s. People may not have like other forces there in the 90s, but at least there was some order during those years.

shaggie
08-08--2006, 02:24 PM
You know, there a really big mentality problem with the Bush administration. This the most thoughtless shallow-minded dim-witted administration the U.S. has ever seen. It thinks nothing about what will happen as a result of its actions and make no plans to deal with contingencies.

Just keep waving the fictitious flag of golden democracy, knock over governments you don't like, and push out other forces you don't like. They did it when they bombed Arafat out of his headquarters (now Hamas is running Palestine); they pushed Syrian peace keeping forces out of Lebanon (now Hezbollah runs that joint); they knocked the government out of Iraq (now tens of thousands are dying in a matter of months). Complete idiots in the Bush administration.

The only thing that keeps it going are more dim-witted people in the public that keep supporting the policies.

shaggie
17-08--2006, 03:35 PM
This just in. 3400 civilians dead in Iraq for July 2006 and 3600 injured. That tops the May and June figures. I'm sure the government has a silver lining to this news too.

We really needed that liquid explosives on the airlines scare to take the attention off the bad news.

Good old Senator Joe Lieberman, the staunch supporter of Bush's Iraq war, didn't make it through the primaries either. So now he intends to run as an independent this fall. Good luck.

matthew
21-08--2006, 04:52 PM
This just in. 3400 civilians dead in Iraq for July 2006 and 3600 injured. That tops the May and June figures. I'm sure the government has a silver lining to this news too.

We really needed that liquid explosives on the airlines scare to take the attention off the bad news.

.



I thought this thread was about Saddams trial ?.
Not how many people are being killed in secterian violence
The current 'airport chaos' etc etc has taken this off the news.. i guess even you can't be arsed to talk about it anymore..as evident in your last post.

I think the golf is the latest think takeing the 'body count' off the news..at the moment. orchestrated by the Bush admin ofcourse.


Saddam is waiting for his verdict from an earlier trial. If found guilty in that case, justice will be swift; there’s a chance he could be executed before this second trial is finished.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/21/notebook/main1915363.shtml

spektre
24-08--2006, 03:02 PM
IMHO i just feel that the reason the trial has been smoked out of the media spotlight is because it isn't the open and shut case the americans thought it was and therefore its starting to look like a joke! (as if it already isn't)
What was the point of getting rid of Saddam any how? We all know that Saddam was put in power to handle the shia stronghold of iran so surely they needed him as dictator. Has the US made a huge mistake now that there is a "democracy" in Iraq. Iran could now be alot more powerful in the middle east especially if the new leader is a Shia muslim, (maybe thats as been their plan from the get go) lets face it the majority of the population is Shia so it wouldn't be hard for Iraq to become a Shia state.
This whole thing is just one whole mess since we stuck our big oar in and yes i mean from the very beginning in the 1950's or was it the crusades....
Damn, it just reinforces my belief that we should just stop acting like we know it all, our lives are better in a lot of ways but we are far from perfect!
Also a favourite past time of mine when the trial was featured heavily on the 24hour new channels, was too mute the sound and make up my own courtroom drama, in the style of that god awful judge judy or even better stars in their eyes- "tonight Matthew i'm going to do hits from the group shawoddy woddy" its been alot more interesting !!

matthew
24-08--2006, 06:45 PM
IMHO i just feel that the reason the trial has been smoked out of the media spotlight is because it isn't the open and shut case the americans thought it was and therefore its starting to look like a joke! (as if it already isn't)

More likely because the initial trial had ended... so there was not much to report. Now the second trial is here.. it is being more covered by the media.



What was the point of getting rid of Saddam any how? We all know that Saddam was put in power to handle the shia stronghold of iran so surely they needed him as dictator. Has the US made a huge mistake now that there is a "democracy" in Iraq.

I don't think so.. 'invadeing' a country.. 'installing' democracy.. fighting tooth an nail with idiots for a few years.. hardly seems likely, that a huge mistake has been made.


Iran could now be alot more powerful in the middle east especially if the new leader is a Shia muslim, (maybe thats as been their plan from the get go) lets face it the majority of the population is Shia so it wouldn't be hard for Iraq to become a Shia state.

Iran is supposedly the more influential nowadays.. because of other situations in the region. A plan maybe in force.. who's plan ? i dunno.


This whole thing is just one whole mess since we stuck our big oar in and yes i mean from the very beginning in the 1950's or was it the crusades....

If you go back to the crusades.. then 'they' started it.. so NOW it is all there fault. 'who' started it is a meaningless pointless excersice.. as who ever did start it won't admit to it. The reasoning from the 'start' was imho because of 'them' rather than 'us'. We could ofcourse argue about it for decades.. i think those that drag decades old fuids into modern day situations are not willing to accept things have changed.. time to move on. If OBL is useing age old greivances then it is just as lame as suicide bombers claiming 'we do it cuz you kill our fellow muslims'.. or 'we do it because of your foreign policy'... absolute crap.



Damn, it just reinforces my belief that we should just stop acting like we know it all, our lives are better in a lot of ways but we are far from perfect!

We are 'less than perfect' shame the other side think THEY are perfect. I think the difference is we accept our faults and attempt reasonable diplomacy... something that can't be said for others in this conflict.



Also a favourite past time of mine when the trial was featured heavily on the 24hour new channels, was too mute the sound and make up my own courtroom drama, in the style of that god awful judge judy or even better stars in their eyes- "tonight Matthew i'm going to do hits from the group shawoddy woddy" its been alot more interesting !!


You should have posted it on 'youtube'... :whistle:

elfqueenofrohan
05-09--2006, 11:15 PM
Isn't the trial still going on, but going nowhere? With Hussien refusing to recognise the court, still...
(to be fair, he is *technically* still the President of Iraq)

matthew
06-09--2006, 11:30 AM
Isn't the trial still going on, but going nowhere? With Hussien refusing to recognise the court, still...
(to be fair, he is *technically* still the President of Iraq)

Yes it is going somewhere... on accasion he refuses to aknowledge the court cuz he wants to grandstand.. ''Technically'' he is not ... [Don't let him tell you otherwise].


Nouri Kamel al-Maliki (Arabic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_alphabet): نوري كامل المالكي, transliterated (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_transliteration) Nūrī Kāmil al-Mālikī; born c. 1950 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1950)), also known as Jawad al-Maliki, is the current Prime Minister of Iraq (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Minister_of_Iraq) following Iraq (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq)'s election (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_legislative_election%2C_December_2 005) in December (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/December) 2005 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005). He is a Shi'a Muslim (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shi%27a_Islam), and is the deputy leader of the Islamic Dawa Party (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Dawa_Party). He was appointed to succeed the transitional government (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Transitional_Government) of fellow Dawa leader Ibrahim al-Jaafari (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibrahim_al-Jaafari). His 37-member Cabinet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_of_Iraq%2C_2006-2010#Ministers) was approved by the National Assembly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Assembly_of_Iraq) and sworn in on May 20 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_20), 2006 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006). Al-Maliki's constitutional mandate (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandate) will last until 2010. On April 26 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_26), 2006 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006), al-Maliki's office announced that he would thenceforth use the first name Nouri instead of his pseudonym Jawad.[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nouri_al-Maliki#_note-chitrib)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nouri_al-Maliki

The Iraqi Interim Government (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Interim_Government) was created by the United States and its coalition allies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multinational_force_in_Iraq) as a caretaker government to rule Iraq (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq) until the Iraqi Transitional Government (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Transitional_Government) was organized following the Iraqi National Assembly election (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_legislative_election%2C_2005). The position of Prime Minister was selected to be the Head of the Government
Under the Iraqi Transitional Government (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Transitional_Government), the Members of the Iraqi National Assembly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_National_Assembly) choose the Presidency Council; including the Prime Minister (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Minister) and the Council of Ministers.
The Presidency Council then shall name a Prime Minister unanimously. According to this, the Presidency Council must agree on a candidate for the post within two weeks. In the event that it fails to do so, the responsibility of naming the Prime Minister reverts to the National Assembly. In that event, the National Assembly must confirm the nomination by a two-thirds majority. If the Prime Minister is unable to nominate his Council of Ministers within one month, the Presidency Council shall name another Prime Minister.
The Prime Minister cannot be appointed to any other position in or out of government. Because of this, no member of the Armed Forces, National Assembly, Minister, or member of the Presidency Council can be elected to this position unless the individual has resigned his commission or rank, or retired from duty at least eighteen months prior to serving.
The Prime Minister serves a four-year term.

elfqueenofrohan
06-09--2006, 04:08 PM
''Technically'' he is not ... [Don't let him tell you otherwise].


:( Am I the only one who feels a bit sorry for him?

matthew
06-09--2006, 04:44 PM
:( Am I the only one who feels a bit sorry for him?

I'd imagine he has lots of loyal fanatics .... why you would feel sorry for a despotic fascist homicidal maniac ... is beyond me. Maybe the beard makes him luck ''cuddly''.. gee whiz.

elfqueenofrohan
07-09--2006, 12:05 AM
I'd imagine he has lots of loyal fanatics .... why you would feel sorry for a despotic fascist homicidal maniac ... is beyond me. Maybe the beard makes him luck ''cuddly''.. gee whiz.

:mad: yes I know he's not very nice. but still... I think maybe he just needed more hugs when he was younger...

Atomik
07-09--2006, 08:07 AM
I'd imagine he has lots of loyal fanatics .... why you would feel sorry for a despotic fascist homicidal maniac ... is beyond me. Maybe the beard makes him luck ''cuddly''.. gee whiz.It's called sympathy, empathy and compassion. Y'knw... the virtues that are meant to set us apart from murdering despotic maniacs? :rolleyes:

Perthite
07-09--2006, 11:26 AM
yeah but you wouldn't want to share a flat with him would you?

Atomik
07-09--2006, 11:27 AM
yeah but you wouldn't want to share a flat with him would you?I wouldn't wanna share a flat with you either. :harhar:

Perthite
07-09--2006, 11:30 AM
well fuck you i'm going to take over a middle eastern country then!

matthew
07-09--2006, 11:40 AM
It's called sympathy, empathy and compassion. Y'knw... the virtues that are meant to set us apart from murdering despotic maniacs? :rolleyes:

I have sympathy, empathy and compassion...this does not spread to the whole of humanity. In my book the other person has to have humanity, for me to give sympathy, empathy and compassion. Infact it is quite nice if the person has a shread of sympathy, empathy and compassion, in the first place. I appreciate i should rise above such pettyness and maybe have unconditional sympathy, empathy and compassion oh i forgot humanity for such a person..you know what i can't. What sets me apart from murdering despotic maniacs is my sympathy, empathy and compassion and humanity.

Have you sympathy, empathy and compassion for this murdering despotic maniac?. :rolleyes:

Atomik
07-09--2006, 11:43 AM
Have you sympathy, empathy and compassion for this murdering despotic maniac?. :rolleyes:Yes. I don't like him, but I still have sympathy, empathy and compassion for him. I have those things for everyone. I guess it's like the christians say.... love the sinner, hate the sin. Well actually I don't believe hate's very constructive either, so I'd probably say 'dislike' the sin. :D

matthew
07-09--2006, 11:47 AM
Yes. I don't like him, but I still have sympathy, empathy and compassion for him. I have those things for everyone. I guess it's like the christians say.... love the sinner, hate the sin. Well actually I don't believe hate's very constructive either, so I'd probably say 'dislike' the sin. :D

I don't like bringing in 'christian' hypocrisy into this type of debate . I understand and have heard this type of sympathy from you before.. plus your 'dislike' for hatred. I think i have also mentioned me wishing to gain that type of understanding.
I've not quite reached [or sank-depending on interpretation] that level yet. I'd still like to pop a cap in his ass.

Atomik
07-09--2006, 11:50 AM
I don't like bringing in 'christian' hypocrisy into this type of debate .It's just a turn of phrase that reflects a philosophy that I essentially agree with.


I understand and have heard this type of sympathy from you before.. plus your 'dislike' for hatred. I think i have also mentioned me wishing to gain that type of understanding.And I respect you for it. :D


I've not quite reached [or sank-depending on interpretation] that level yet. I'd still like to pop a cap in his ass.But once you start down that road, you're enjoying the suffering of others.... which is exactly where your fascist dictators start out.

matthew
07-09--2006, 11:59 AM
It's just a turn of phrase that reflects a philosophy that I essentially agree with.

I appreciate that.. and i agree with the sentiment myself [to a degree] . I came to that conclusion with out the help of christ. I imagine you may have of too ?.


And I respect you for it. :D

Cheears..



But once you start down that road, you're enjoying the suffering of others.... which is exactly where your fascist dictators start out.


I don't know about that, maybe they were evil little bastards in the first place. Awaiting 'power' too inflict themselves on a population at a given time !.
I don't think i'd give him the pleasure of 'enjoying' his suffering. Maybe 'popping a cap in his ass' is a little beyond what i'd like to see him endure, 'push come to shove'. Life in prison is acceptable to me.

Atomik
07-09--2006, 12:01 PM
I appreciate that.. and i agree with the sentiment myself [to a degree] . I came to that conclusion with out the help of christ. I imagine you may have of too ?. I think that's a pretty safe bet. :D


I don't know about that, maybe they were evil little bastards in the first place. Awaiting 'power' too inflict themselves on a population at a given time !.I don't believe people are born evil. I think things make them evil. Al though I don't really believe in evil either as such.


I don't think i'd give him the pleasure of 'enjoying' his suffering. Maybe 'popping a cap in his ass' is a little beyond what i'd like to see him endure, 'push come to shove'. Life in prison is acceptable to me.I have no problem with him spending life in prison.

matthew
07-09--2006, 12:14 PM
I think that's a pretty safe bet. :D

I thought hoped as much.


I don't believe people are born evil. I think things make them evil. Al though I don't really believe in evil either as such.

Nagh.. i don't like the word myself. Lets say he was not 'evil' at birth and certain things did push him to his ultimate zenith. Thousands even hundreds of thousands.. maybe even millions.. of people also have had the same upbringing [to a lesser and greater extent] . They have not wished to wipe ethnicities from the face of the planet.. have they ?. He is a very inteligent person, i'm sure fully aware of his actions and i'ts ramifications. It might be in contension if he was aware enough, he knew what he was doing was 'evil'.. but i do think he must have been aware of 'right and wrong' .. therefore 'evil' must have crossed his mind. He did show sympathy, empathy and compassion and humanity .. when he wished. This makes me think he was a self appointed 'evil' person.



I have no problem with him spending life in prison.


I forgot : daily shock therapy.... i joke. ;)

Atomik
07-09--2006, 12:18 PM
Nagh.. i don't like the word myself. Lets say he was not 'evil' at birth and certain things did push him to his ultimate zenith. Thousands even hundreds of thousands.. maybe even millions.. of people also have had the same upbringing [to a lesser and greater extent] . They have not wished to wipe ethnicities from the face of the planet.. have they ?. He is a very inteligent person, i'm sure fully aware of his actions and i'ts ramifications. It might be in contension if he was aware enough, he knew what he was doing was 'evil'.. but i do think he must have been aware of 'right and wrong' .. therefore 'evil' must have crossed his mind. He did show sympathy, empathy and compassion and humanity .. when he wished. This makes me think he was a self appointed 'evil' person.There are so many different factors that make us the people we are, you can't say that "millions" have had the same upbringing. They may have had similar, but that's not the same thing. But this is really missing the point.... I'm not saying that any of this is an excuse or justification, or that he doesn't have free will.... just that my compassion still extends to him. I don't like seeing anyone suffer, no matter what they've done.

matthew
07-09--2006, 12:33 PM
There are so many different factors that make us the people we are, you can't say that "millions" have had the same upbringing. They may have had similar, but that's not the same thing. But this is really missing the point.... I'm not saying that any of this is an excuse or justification, or that he doesn't have free will.... just that my compassion still extends to him. I don't like seeing anyone suffer, no matter what they've done.

Ok... fair enough...

I did say 'maybe even' .

So when civil liberties groups push for his release after he has shown marked remorse and aknowledgment for his actions. And push for his release into i would say excile.. You would have no problem with that ?. If he does show these 'qualities' surely any further 'suffering' that i'm sure prison will endure him.. will be intolerable. Imho at some point you have to deal with the person harshly and 'brutaly'.. or lock the person up and throw away the key ..also turn your back on such a person. Never to look at that person again.

Atomik
07-09--2006, 12:38 PM
So when civil liberties groups push for his release after he has shown marked remorse and aknowledgment for his actions. And push for his release into i would say excile.. You would have no problem with that ?It would depend. It'd be kinda hard to judge whether he was showing genuine remorse. I don't really have any problem with him living out the rest of his days outside prison, if he's living modestly and not enjoying the fruits of his despotism. I don't see what punishing people indefinitely really achieves.

matthew
07-09--2006, 01:01 PM
It would depend. It'd be kinda hard to judge whether he was showing genuine remorse.

People deciede that now..and people are released on their assesments. It is not a new concept.


I don't really have any problem with him living out the rest of his days outside prison, if he's living modestly and not enjoying the fruits of his despotism.

I'm a LONG way from your level... maybe a house in the south of France could be arranged for him.:whistle:



I don't see what punishing people indefinitely really achieves


Reassurance at least.

Atomik
07-09--2006, 01:15 PM
People deciede that now..and people are released on their assesments. It is not a new concept. Not for genocide, generally. :D


I'm a LONG way from your level... maybe a house in the south of France could be arranged for him.:whistle:I was thinking more like a councile house in Swansea. :reddevil:


Reassurance at least.Meaning?

matthew
07-09--2006, 01:26 PM
Not for genocide, generally. :D

No.. obviously not. Though it is a bit of a red herring as he is not under our judicial procedures. More than likely they will hang him. Though i don't know if he carried out 'evil' act himself ?.. so maybe when pyschologists look at sex offenders or serial murderers .. they can see if 'remorse' is genuine.. if a person who carries out 'evil' acts in the 2rd person.. It is not as black and white as i make out.. but i'm sure you appreciate thay take on board the subtlties of individuals... regardless of their crime.


I was thinking more like a council house in Swansea. :reddevil:

Try Leicester :whistle:



Meaning?


That he is 'paying' for his crimes for ever more.

elfqueenofrohan
07-09--2006, 02:46 PM
"He who chases monsters must see that he does not become a monster himself."

Dapablo
14-09--2006, 09:26 PM
Well he's quite chuffed to hear he isn't a dictator anyway, it all the fault of people around him, obvious, he's just a misunderstood benelovent leader, now why didn't I see that, duh. :)

elfqueenofrohan
14-09--2006, 10:53 PM
:mad: