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Thread: Should we be allow euthanasia

  1. #1
    Heavenly Creature Wulfie's Avatar
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    Should we be allow euthanasia

    If someone has a incurable disease, MS, Parkinsons ect or an injury, quadriplegics ect should they be forced to travel to Switzerland if they decide enoughs enough as their quality of life is over or should it be allowed here or should it not be permitted at all.

    The beautiful death scene from the movie Soylent Green has stuck in my mind from the first time that I saw it, can't remember much else but those images to Peer Gynt are something else (and Ed Robinson was a great actor)



    My views are it should be here in the UK with safeguards and a strict criteria for those who are physically ill and want out and that their wishes are backed or rejected by a medical panel. All life is precious but should we make people suffer against their wishes. Give them a glorious sendoff and a release or what. (the person concerned is fully compus mentus and it is solely their decision)
    Last edited by Wulfie; 13-01--2017 at 08:56 AM.
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  2. #2
    Me gone,bye bye.. NomadicRT's Avatar
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    People who are terminally ill or suffering SHOULD have the right to end their life if they choose and at home with loved ones if thats possible.
    It pisses me off with the hypocrisy in this country,the Government wont fund the best diagnosis treatment research or drugs for life changing illness or injury but wont allow a person the right to end their life if they choose to opt out of the pain and poor quality of life..and worse they spend years fighting people in court over their wish to die in a dignified manner of their choosing.
    Its also pretty discriminatory that as a fit and able bodied person -sane or otherwise - you may end your life at any time you choose by any method of your choice but if youre trapped and suffering in an unresponsive body you can neither take your own life and prevented from taking any action to do so unless youre lucky enough to make it to Switzerland.
    I think the obvious inference from this is if youre ever diagnosed with a debilitating terminal illness,then set about ending your life while you still can.
    Last edited by NomadicRT; 13-01--2017 at 10:23 AM.
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  3. #3
    Shed Junkie alices wonderland's Avatar
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    I often wonder what the very best chemical is to perform the transition? I would think there are a abundance of plant /fungi parts than can be found, bought, cultivated. Only many have other compounds in them that may make the experience unpleasant, it's not like we are really stuck for methods of taking ones own life. So I don't think the government can actually stop some people exercising their right to commit suicide. If there was a "shut down now" plant, snake, spider or something from nature that would produce kinder, less distressing results.

    You can't trust a street drug dealer to come back in ten minutes with 500 of heroin, that's clean enough to see grandma off to the Wi in the sky.
    Most DIY attempts get altered on discovery and vital life saving care is administered to the individual. Even if longterm kidney damage is likely as a result of the attempted suicide. So the poor bastard is in more difficulty or discomfort , but living.

    So what is the preferred method of choice here in the UK? Switzerland? USA etc?

    In Countries like India and Africa. The most widely used method of suicide is deliberate consumption of herbicides, pesticides. Due to the ease of availability and cheap price. Many of these chemicals are actually banned in the U.K and EU.
    The only sure thing about suicide is there's no coming back.

    If it were legalised it could be a wonderful alternative to horrendous life long suffering for some & the best methods made available.
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  4. #4
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    I'm not sure our society is fit for this, there is far too much greed and emphasis on money, and Granny might be sitting in a valuable house that the grand-children covet.

    People already get murdered for their money, it not difficult to imagine old people being persuaded to end it all so the kids can have a holiday in Disneyworld.
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  5. #5
    Heavenly Creature cricket's Avatar
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    I think there is concern that the unscrupulous may terminate others wrongly.The care home absorbing all inheritance money, that is then taken to sustain an aged/terminally ill person ,may prove a reason for some...or insurance payouts?However I am aware of many persons also, in media reports and one with ms myself that simply want to leave and feel they are just waiting for death.It is disgraceful that the very ill are forced abroad into a strange place to die.The suffering to their loved ones must be so distressing too.I understand that hypothermia is a quiet ending.There is an organisation called EXIT that talks to people.The last time I tried to look at it I had a message..google wants to know your location..so I never looked.I agree there must be a lovely happy peaceful drug to go out on.Several terminal friends have gone out on morphine with cancer and one had horrors ,the other we dont know.I also knew a teen who od on paracetemol and survived only to be told she would soon die anyhow due to massive liver damage.Just awful.The thought of leaving my life in a hospital side room fills me with dread.I hope to be under a tree up a mountain or in a wood.Death is our certain future so why all the taboos?
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    Heavenly Creature Editor aman's Avatar
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    I read that nitrogen is a good way to go but I have no evidence to back that up.

    Nitrogen bottle and an oxygen mask

    Paul
    PⒶUL
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    UK Hippy Reiki Doula Editor Sarah's Avatar
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    Yes we should allow people to choose to end their own lives if they so wish and have been deemed to have the mental capacity to make such a decision or have previously made an advanced care planning directive that this is their wish should their well being deteriorate to a level that they decided when they had mental capacity that they did not wish to live at.... drives me fucking insane that we still having this discussion as a species ffs!
    If we are to heal the planet, we must begin by healing birthing.
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    Originally Posted by NomadicRT
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    People who are terminally ill or suffering SHOULD have the right to end their life if they choose and at home with loved ones if thats possible.
    Unfortunately, those loved ones might have an interest, either through greed, carer fatigue, or just exasperation at how long it is taking Auntie to peg it, and they are the ones who are whispering in the ear of the dear old thing, so she decides to go "for the kids", IOW to leave an estate "worth having".

    HMG are clearly terrified of mass suicide because they have made anthying which looks like a suitable poison impossible to own without prescription. I would like to think that the terminally ill might act in concert in this regard, perhaps when the Tories are returned again at the next General Election.

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    Originally Posted by Sarah
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    .. drives me fucking insane that we still having this discussion as a species ffs!
    There are reasons for that to which even the insane have access - if they really care to know.

  10. #10
    UK Hippy Reiki Doula Editor Sarah's Avatar
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    Which is why we have such a thing as advanced care planning and directives, we have systems in place for protecting and honouring individuals mental capacity and ability to make decisions... it's not much of a leap when we can already put in place DNAR's
    If we are to heal the planet, we must begin by healing birthing.
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    I would not like to live with a health condition you would put a dog to sleep with.
    There's something wrong with a society that treats animals with more compassion than humans.
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    Comfortably Numb Rick69's Avatar
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    As someone who has watched a loved one go downhill and spend a long period bedridden, wasting away, in pain and certain of the knowledge that they are dying then absolutely yes it should be an option that is available to them.
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  13. #13
    Heavenly Creature Roamer's Avatar
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    I'm going to die in an armchair at 99 watching the racing
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    If i dont die of indigestion from stewed apples first that is.

  14. #14
    Good article by Douglas Murray -
    The Low Countries slide down the euthanasia slippery slope.


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  15. #15
    I work in palliative care. It's such an emotive subject. The original hippocratic oath forbids the physician from administering poison or suggesting its administration. This would forbid the physician from engaging in euthanasia and, all the more so, any role in physician-assisted suicide.


  16. #16
    Me gone,bye bye.. NomadicRT's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Brynhyffryd
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    Unfortunately, those loved ones might have an interest, either through greed, carer fatigue, or just exasperation at how long it is taking Auntie to peg it, and they are the ones who are whispering in the ear of the dear old thing, so she decides to go "for the kids", IOW to leave an estate "worth having".

    HMG are clearly terrified of mass suicide because they have made anthying which looks like a suitable poison impossible to own without prescription. I would like to think that the terminally ill might act in concert in this regard, perhaps when the Tories are returned again at the next General Election.
    With the same protections in place as youll find in a hospice and administered by a professional care team i think there would be little room for manipulation by relatives.Providing the assessments checks and balances are in place why not? as opposed to a hospice to die. HMG always has double standards when it comes to our wellbeing when it suits.We must not end our lives but HMG will happily end them for us in the right beneficial circumstances (for them)....war riot plague ...in such circumstances we are expendable nothings.
    When it suits them,keeping us tied to expensive drug regimes to prolong our lives and the profits of their big pharma friends our lives are 'sacred'.
    Ironic that those who have access to the very best health and end of life care via their privileged status,happily deny us access to the same.
    Last edited by NomadicRT; 13-01--2017 at 07:28 PM.
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    Originally Posted by NomadicRT
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    With the same protections in place as youll find in a hospice and administered by a professional care team i think there would be little room for manipulation by relatives.
    Maybe, what proportion of people die in a hospice? But pressure can be subtle and not much is needed when the subject feels guilty about the cost of their care.
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    Me gone,bye bye.. NomadicRT's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Brynhyffryd
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    Maybe, what proportion of people die in a hospice? But pressure can be subtle and not much is needed when the subject feels guilty about the cost of their care.
    Im sure there are HMG statistics on that somewhere on the net but aside from sudden cardiac death or accident, the majority of people die in hospital or hospice.
    Pressures can be subtle but care and psychological assessment can be too to discover malicious intent in the same way it uncovers persistent abuse of children and elderly at home.

    To set too high a fence to exclude any possible family pressure in a minority of instances denies the majority the right to die in a manner of their own choice.
    Its for the law and parliament to ensure the right checks and balances for the rights people want.Not for parliament to deny people the rights they want over their own life.
    Politicians and upper house parliamentarians persistently criticise the 'nanny state' mentality for interfering in every aspect of peoples lives yet they persist in doing just that which they criticise.
    Last edited by NomadicRT; 13-01--2017 at 07:51 PM.
    Hebridean at heart..everywhere else is just somewhere on the way back there...
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    Originally Posted by Brynhyffryd
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    Maybe, what proportion of people die in a hospice? But pressure can be subtle and not much is needed when the subject feels guilty about the cost of their care.
    In West Norfolk there aren't any bedded hospices (the new hospice I work in will be opening beds later this year). Most of our patients die at home with community services supporting. We do have beds in nursing homes if needed and of course in the acute hospitals (which aren't ideal). To regulate would be a mine field.


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    Heavenly Creature Wulfie's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Brynhyffryd
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    Maybe, what proportion of people die in a hospice? But pressure can be subtle and not much is needed when the subject feels guilty about the cost of their care.
    There is no cost to the dying person anywhere as CHC kicks in. It's a barstard to get it for someone who's not terminal as Social Services v NHS can be right c**** but for the dying it's there for anyone not on NHS premises.
    Not all who wander are lost

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    Heavenly Creature Wulfie's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Rick69
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    As someone who has watched a loved one go downhill and spend a long period bedridden, wasting away, in pain and certain of the knowledge that they are dying then absolutely yes it should be an option that is available to them.
    Been there, 3 weeks of drugged pain and finally the little morphine device which the nurse explained how it works.
    Not all who wander are lost

  22. #22
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    I've been present when the doctor took a daughter aside and explained that her mother was going to die and would she mind taking her home because the hospital was full. Six months later the old lady is eating like a horse, thanks to lashings of love and care. In vulnerable situations we are not machines, and the "ambience of care"** can be the difference between life and death.

    ** I just made that one up, nice phrase no?
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    Heavenly Creature Roamer's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Brynhyffryd
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    Maybe, what proportion of people die in a hospice? But pressure can be subtle and not much is needed when the subject feels guilty about the cost of their care.
    I disagree. Being elderly & in need doesnt mean people roll over. Sometimes there is nobody more stubborn than the elderly.
    Dont underestimate hem.
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  24. #24
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    Originally Posted by Wulfie
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    There is no cost to the dying person anywhere as CHC kicks in.
    What's CHC?

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