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Thread: Animal agriculture UK 2016

  1. #361
    Comfortably Numb Rick69's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ma bungo
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    The shop could get it from a whorehouse
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    Plenty of tripe and liver i would imagine.
    And plenty of mayonnaise to keep hagrid happy.



    Mmm salty
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  2. #362
    Walking back to happiness ma bungo's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Rick69
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    Plenty of tripe and liver i would imagine.
    And plenty of mayonnaise to keep hagrid happy.



    Mmm salty
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    You cheeky letter changer
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  3. #363
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    Will the warehouses get the "food" arriving in lorries? with pointy-shoe'd cunts' advertising slogan mission-statements painted on the side? In that case we have lost the war
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  4. #364
    Walking back to happiness ma bungo's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Uncle jhad
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    Will the warehouses get the "food" arriving in lorries? with pointy-shoe'd cunts' advertising slogan mission-statements painted on the side? In that case we have lost the war
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    No , it will be delivered by 14 year old boys with pudding basin haircuts on bicycles with baskets on the front like in the old hovis advert .It will be like before the war
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  5. #365
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    Originally Posted by ma bungo
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    No , it will be delivered by 14 year old boys with pudding basin haircuts on bicycles with baskets on the front like in the old hovis advert .It will be like before the war
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    Which war?
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  6. #366
    Heavenly Creature parrotandcrow's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ma bungo
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    No , it will be delivered by 14 year old boys with pudding basin haircuts on bicycles with baskets on the front like in the old hovis advert .It will be like before the war
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    Nay, the 14 year old men will be down t' pit, doing a proper day's work. It'll be 6 year olds on the way back from their paper rounds.
    If men bore wings and had black feathers, few would be intelligent enough to be crows.
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  7. #367
    Walking back to happiness ma bungo's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Uncle jhad
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    Which war?
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    Crusades ?

  8. #368
    Walking back to happiness ma bungo's Avatar
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    Come on peeps , back on track , this is a serious thread
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  9. #369
    Tuning In Red Dragon's Avatar
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    Come on folks, enough with the jokes, my sides hurt enough from all the laughing, the last thing I need is to crack a rib!!!
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  10. #370
    Comfortably Numb Rick69's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ma bungo
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    You cheeky letter changer
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    Under the circumstances i felt the change was warranted.

  11. #371
    Heavenly Creature cricket's Avatar
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    The ultimate expression ??
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    That sounds like species ego talking.We are the most adaptive,inventive and destructive that is all.We have/are knowingly and with awareness of consequences destroying the earth our only known host planet.Also our conscience and spirituality banged on about often like some get out card is a farce when we knowingly allow obscene deliberate cruelty to other beings including our own species.To do nothing is to condone any action.The hysterically funny irony is that when the Kessler Effect kicks in ,a matter of when not if, we will all be trapped on our empty planet by our own rubbish.Maybe intelligent forces are at work or maybe nature itself allowed us to "evolve"sufficiently in order to produce in effect, the ecapsulating of a poor evolutionary result and in so doing protect the universe from us.The slaughter house depravity is beyond my understanding.Until someone has been in close and truly understood other species the suffering is unlikely to be understood.Many people do not even know a calf is needed to get milk.Yes I watched the film.I have seen many which haunt me.The farmed cats and dogs for meat.The horses slaughtered in Mexico by hacking at their spine till they fall.I feel overwhelmed often by the horror of our actions.

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    Originally Posted by Boaty McBoatface
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    The majority of climate change research is focused on preserving mankind. That's why we do it.

    99% of all species that ever lived on Earth are extinct, the vast majority before Humans evolved, when humans are gone life will carry on. If you really want to enjoy your guilt consider this - by preserving todays life you are denying life to the species not yet evolved.

    Be realistic, we are the ultimate expression of evolution, let us care for the planet that spawned us so as not to go the same way as the dinosaurs - but also consider that if we do suffer an extinction event ( man-made or not ) life will continue, evolve, and maybe surpass us.

  12. #372
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    Originally Posted by cricket
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    The ultimate expression ??
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    That sounds like species ego talking.
    Species ego ? That's new to me, however I'm prepared to walk the walk and debate the matter with any other species that wishes to comment.
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  13. #373
    Shed Junkie alices wonderland's Avatar
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    The adult human heart pumps an average of 6,000 litres of blood around the body each day. Make no wonder it doesn't really have much time for soft brown fury creatures with watery eyes. I forgive myself.
    even a gypsy caravan is too much settling down.

  14. #374
    Heavenly Creature cricket's Avatar
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    Where did you find out that most deer have TB?I have often thought it stupid that in Gloucestershire Forest of Dean with killing badgers in the name of TB everyone ignores the over running population of free roaming,wide ranging muncjac deer all over the place.Do you mean as carriers?How is that determined?

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    Originally Posted by hagrid
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    but townies cant stand the idea of culling "Bambie" do they? they just have no concept of the overgrazing and damage they cause to the natural environment through overbreeding, most have TB but that is never mentioned either.

  15. #375
    Heavenly Creature cricket's Avatar
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    some apparently have not.
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    Originally Posted by hagrid
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    going back to the trees is different to having no roads, we all lost our prehensile tails a long time ago.

  16. #376
    Heavenly Creature cricket's Avatar
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    ?Where was there mention or any implication that human suffering was of lesser importance?Humans are the controllers of less dominant species.ok?If there is suffering of those we control of course it is therefore by our hand.Why do humans consider their right to life to be more valid than those we control for our own ends?If you see all beings as of similiar worth, then it is black and white. Who are we to judge worth?If you do not see that,how can you comprehend that artificial forced insemination of another being in order to produce another being , that is then deprived of its intended evolutionary existence is wrong? Instead of running free foraging being itself,being incarcerated a small cage etc is wrong?You either get it or you do not.As for abatoirs..the suffering starts when they are loaded and then it can be many hours before the drawn out horror of the abatoir,which they all could smell a long way before arrival probably.

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    Originally Posted by Red Dragon
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    Well Paul, I am loathe to admit it but you have worn me out with all your ducking and diving to avoid answering what are phrased as closed questions, whilst only providing in-depth posts on your own particular set of beliefs and values. Perhaps you will breathe a little easier now it's unlikely that I will reply to anything more that you post in this thread.

    As I've said before, I respect your point of view, even if I don't agree with some of it.

    For you, there appears to be no grey areas, just black and white and so you appear to see the suffering of all animals as something of paramount importance that needs to be fixed. However, what I really can't understand is why you can brush off the suffering of the human animal as of lesser importance than the suffering of what I choose to call industrial animals because you feel that there are enough people interested in the suffering of human animals.

    It is still my contention that we would have more success in countering the suffering and abuse of all animals if we managed to instil humanity into humans. Once humans turn inhumanity into humanity for their fellows they are far more likely to see and fix the injustices perpetrated on the rest of the animal kingdom. As mentioned earlier, to me the thin end of the wedge is the place to start and that's the human end. The other end of the wedge is, as the world operates at the moment, too large.

    You and those who share your exacting beliefs are trying to overturn the financial behemoth of supply and consumption using a toothpick as a lever. I wish you good fortune but feel that you are being unrealistic in your methods and expectations.

  17. #377
    Tuning In Red Dragon's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by cricket
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    ?Where was there mention or any implication that human suffering was of lesser importance?
    Paul did state in response to my post regarding an accident involving a horse and rider that he would look after the horse first and so I find it difficult to see that in other way than human suffering is less important.
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  18. #378
    Heavenly Creature cricket's Avatar
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    Has it ever occurred to you at all,that your perceptionand/your ability to comprehend empathy may be lacking?Why are you mocking others rather than challenging your own perception in order to broaden your comprehension and maybe step out from behind your safe tree and learn something??

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    Originally Posted by Boaty McBoatface
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    I confess to being puzzled by people who can't tell the difference between Humans and Animals. If they cannot see the huge difference between a Human and a Rabbit, it's no surprise they have to colour everything black or white - to help them see.

  19. #379
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    Originally Posted by cricket
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    Has it ever occurred to you at all,that your perceptionand/your ability to comprehend empathy may be lacking?Why are you mocking others rather than challenging your own perception in order to broaden your comprehension and maybe step out from behind your safe tree and learn something??
    No, it hasn't occurred to me. I treat my animals well, that tells me that my empathy is functioning and I am able to see shades of grey which means my perception seems to work too.

    I am suspicious of people who only see black or white, virtue or evil. They are the people who lack empathy for other peoples views, they are the extremists. I've read on this forum posts supporting the murder and mutilation of humans for the "crime" of hunting foxes. Does that sound like the action of an empath or an extremist ?

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    Originally Posted by cricket
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    Has it ever occurred to you at all,that your perceptionand/your ability to comprehend empathy may be lacking?Why are you mocking others rather than challenging your own perception in order to broaden your comprehension and maybe step out from behind your safe tree and learn something??
    No, it hasn't occurred to me. I treat my animals well, that tells me that my empathy is functioning and I am able to see shades of grey which means my perception seems to work too.

    I am suspicious of people who only see black or white, virtue or evil. They are the people who lack empathy for other peoples views, they are the extremists. I've read on this forum posts supporting the murder and mutilation of humans for the "crime" of hunting foxes. Does that sound like the action of an empath or an extremist ?
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  20. #380
    Abandon ship. Duckman's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Paul
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    There is plant based fertiliser, and oil is not considered to be animal exploitation (they died millions of years ago dude) but again this is an example of a "what about" argument that uses unavoidable/incidental harm to excuse deliberate harm.
    People can choose not to drive, but I agree, too many people made too much fuss about the fiver when not considering the way animal expolitationextends into so many everyday things.
    Plant fertilizer? You mean green manures? This only bring nitrogen to the soil.Seaweed fertilizer have their uses, but contain little in the way of N:P:K. Google NPK if you do not know what it means. The problem with liquid chemical fertilier is that is destroys the micro-organisms in the soil.
    Depending on the company you keep can bring out the best in you, or the worst in you.
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  21. #381
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    As I might have implied in my last post, I think it's largely a matter of what we get habituated to over a matter of time. The home environment, cultural customs, school, college or early work; all tend to reinforce an interest in some things, an ignorance of others. The rearing and husbandry and slaughter of commercial animals does not figure to any large degree in anyone's upbringing outside of farming families. So to most people it is not something they bother about unless either something awakens them, or some circumstance forces their attention upon it.

    The analogy with slavery and the slave trade I consider valid from the ethical point of view, but of course it has other limitations. One is the 'otherness' of animals. Whatever size, colour or creed a slave may be, he/she is still clearly recognisable as being of the human race. So the feeling of empathy is more easily aroused, perhaps, than with animals which look quite different, and whom we are brought up to regard as food on - mostly - four legs.

    The whole of our recent history and religions over perhaps the past ten thousand years has taught us to regard ourselves as the pinnacle of achievement of some godly creator, with all the lesser creatures of the Earth as ours to kill or use as we wish. This will not be changed very quickly, and, considering the present state of the world, is less than likely to be caused by ethical conscience-raising than by force of circumstance. People in our grandfather's day ate far less meat because it was quite expensive, hence the saving for the Xmas turkey or goose.
    As a kid I remember that we had meat at weekends, the 'Sunday Roast' it was called, but it had to be spun out into the rest of the week, if there was anything left of it. Although we kept chickens, they were rarely for table, but kept for eggs. When meat becomes too expensive again, the mass of people will eat less of it. If we ourselves do not stop breeding and increasing in numbers, a time will come when land used for growing food for livestock will have to be turned over to growing food for humans.
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  22. #382
    Heavenly Creature cricket's Avatar
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    Out of a specific debate conversation context any opinion or point raised may be inserted to manipulate anything.You are still seeking to snipe and divert focus from the point in question.Are you a politician?

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    Originally Posted by Boaty McBoatface
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    No, it hasn't occurred to me. I treat my animals well, that tells me that my empathy is functioning and I am able to see shades of grey which means my perception seems to work too.

    I am suspicious of people who only see black or white, virtue or evil. They are the people who lack empathy for other peoples views, they are the extremists. I've read on this forum posts supporting the murder and mutilation of humans for the "crime" of hunting foxes. Does that sound like the action of an empath or an extremist ?

    - - - Updated - - -



    No, it hasn't occurred to me. I treat my animals well, that tells me that my empathy is functioning and I am able to see shades of grey which means my perception seems to work too.

    I am suspicious of people who only see black or white, virtue or evil. They are the people who lack empathy for other peoples views, they are the extremists. I've read on this forum posts supporting the murder and mutilation of humans for the "crime" of hunting foxes. Does that sound like the action of an empath or an extremist ?

  23. #383
    Heavenly Creature cricket's Avatar
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    i didnt see that post so i cannot comment .The horse may have been more injured ,lacking vet care but would probably be in greater distress lacking comprehension maybe of the situation.The horse is also a human slave in effect ,maybe forced to do something extreme?I have been a groom,a shepherd,cowherd,been to agri college,lived rural most of my life, in my life so my view is not from in front of a tv.

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    Originally Posted by Red Dragon
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    Paul did state in response to my post regarding an accident involving a horse and rider that he would look after the horse first and so I find it difficult to see that in other way than human suffering is less important.

  24. #384
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    Originally Posted by cricket
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    Out of a specific debate conversation context any opinion or point raised may be inserted to manipulate anything.You are still seeking to snipe and divert focus from the point in question.Are you a politician?
    Not a politician, not very "politically correct", not bothered by it.

    It appears to me that you are once again charging in with entrenched views, not actually reading what I have written. If you are able to read this line then, physically, you are able to see grey - it's not a big step to comprehend grey too.

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